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Metcalfe: SEPTA is Welfare
#1
Oh Darryl. You never cease to amaze. Now it's the inability to comprehend fractions.

[Image: MetcalfeInfoWars2.jpg]
http://www.citypaper.net/blogs/nakedcity....html?&c=n

Quote:Funding for SEPTA and other public transit is "subsidizing a minority of our population’s bus fare, which is just more welfare," said state Rep. Daryl Metcalfe (R-Butler), according to an e-mail discussion obtained by the Capitolwire news service (subscription only).

Metcalfe's comments were sparked by an e-mail sent out by Rep. Tom Killion (R-Delaware) citing "a new report [that] showed 27 percent of the state’s transportation funding went to southeastern Pennsylvania – Bucks, Philadelphia, Delaware, Chester and Montgomery counties – while that region had 32 percent of the state population and 40 percent of the state’s economic activity."


So wait let me get this straight... for a region that consists of 4 counties that has 40% of the economic activity in all of PA, we only use up 27% of PA transportation dollars while we have 32% of the state's population?

That means the Delaware Valley is subsidizing transit for the rest of the PA, not sucking it.

P.S. all but 2 board members of SEPTA are from the suburban counties based on its state charter. The Philadelphia mayor only gets to pick two and the governor of PA is de-facto chair. But I guess the Loser From Butler County wouldn't know that because you know... facts.

Tell me... if we build or repair a 20 mile road that ultimately serves no purpose but to reach a community of 50 people in the hinterlands that costs 20 million to build... isn't that welfare?



And why SEPTA isn't privatized.... everyone who knows this history up-close is most likely dead because this happened so long ago, but all the rail systems in Philadelphia were once private expect for the Market Street Subway which the City of Philadelphia originally paid to build. Every other railroad through town was all privately-owned. There were no less than 20 different rail and streetcar companies at the time. They were all demolished by the massive government subsidization for the automobile, which rail couldn't compete with for convenience.

The Pennsy (PRR) and Reading Railroad Companies folded into Conrail, and then from that the passenger service lines where continued as SEPTA while ROW's were set up for Conrail to sell back to long haul freight carriers seeking to reach the port terminals and to carry cargo through the area.

The Norristown High Speed Line was once the Red Arrow Company; that was folded under SEPTA too. So are the Kawasaki Subway-Surface trolley lines. And the two light rail trolley lines going to Media and Sharon Hill. All originally private.


All of it died thanks to the car.


And if you turn off SEPTA you're talking no less than 200K extra cars on the road every day all day.... but that's in a region that Darryl Metcalfe couldn't give a shit about because he never has to drive through here or put up with the Schuylkill.


When will this fatass get a coronary and die and save us all from his synaptic misfires? I'm embarrassed that THIS human being is supposed to be the champion of gun rights in PA and is justifying the right to the ill-informed.
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#2
I have no idea what you're saying except a string of contradictions. Were private railways better? Did they go down because of welfare for roads or not? How about we understand that it is welfare and road construction is welfare as well. How about we just simply get government out of both road an rail construction and toll every road?
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#3
I think he is saying that he uses SEPTA so he is not against THIS form of .gov welfare.
Dave, proudly annoying members of pa2a.org since Sep 2012.
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#4
Like it when it serves me hate it when it serves others. Got it. See that a lot around here.
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#5
Dave;100743 Wrote:I think he is saying that he uses SEPTA so he is not against THIS form of .gov welfare.

Yes I use SEPTA but I also walk to work when the temps are above 60F. I did so all this week.

By me not driving, I'm giving you 9 feet of extra space on I-95 that I would otherwise be using. Because I don't drive hardly at all, I'm avoiding funding terrorist countries like Saudi Arabia which the rest of you freely give your hard-earned cash to. Mass transit indirectly subsidizes car use because it relieves pressure on arterials where transit stations are. When I do use transit, it's electric-powered and power generation comes from the nuke plants or from the PJM interconnection... mostly nat-gas based power. All local.


Every global economic powerhouse city in the world, including all the cities that are key to the world's financial system, are heavily laced with mass transit because a bunch of people want to live in a very limited amount of room and no amount of road building will mean a commute almost free of using the brake pedal.

I grew up around cities with almost zero mass transit. I live in one that has good mass transit. It's not the best, but it's a lot better than driving on Ye Olde Schuylkill.

ExcelToExcel;100745 Wrote:Like it when it serves me hate it when it serves others. Got it. See that a lot around here.

Hah nice attempt but you fail.

"I get a lot of people at my town hall meetings complaining about this"

REALLY? People in Butler County their #1 issue is SEPTA spending?

For reals? SEPTA has one of the highest farebox recovery ratios in the US. More of its operations come from the farebox than state spending than any other system. It shuttles quite a number of Republican voters to their jobs in reverse commutes and to the airport.



I think Darryl Metcalfe is part of the same crowd who coined Atlanta's system (MARTA)... "Moving Africans Rapidly Through Atlanta"
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#6
SEPTA is 100% the very definition of failure in mass transit. The only subsidizing going on is to their stupid piece of shit union that has the city by the balls and makes them fold to their every whim. Every time I took the bus in Philly I always found myself enraged by the experience. I used to particularly like waiting 40 minutes on the C bus at night in the rain on Broad and boarding the first one that pulled up way late, paranoid I wouldn't see another C bus for another hour. Then after getting off... I would always see 2 other C buses almost empty tailgating the first rather than being spaced out at regular intervals, this was a pretty much daily occurrence. Then the regional rail ain't exactly cheap either. Nearly every subway station was filthy and smelled like piss constantly and would turn into a waterfall / subterranean river system regularly during rainstorms. The city hall station has major structural problems if you know where to look. The booth staff is pretty much always worthless and nasty. The token machines rarely would accept US currency as payment and would create massive lines while SEPTA has been saying for a decade they they were going to convert to a card system like every other major metro...I can go on and on. I don't know where the fuck that subsidy money goes because it certainly doesn't go into providing service comparable to EVERY other major city in the US. I also love the strategy of going in strike in the middle of the night without warning and stranding anyone who didn't work the day shift, giving the big fuck-off to their ridership. Holy shit they even had to shut down a station before Chinatown on the subway line because the crime got so out of control they couldn't deal with it. If you look carefully out the subway windows on the way down the Chinatown spur you can catch a glimpse of the abandoned station on the orange line.

Fuck SEPTA and their union. Here's that subsidy money for you hard at work...

[Image: septapuzzle.jpg]
The forum poster formerly known as Emoticon...
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#7
ArcticSplash;100746 Wrote:By me not driving, I'm giving you 9 feet of extra space on I-95 that I would otherwise be using. Because I don't drive hardly at all, I'm avoiding funding terrorist countries like Saudi Arabia which the rest of you freely give your hard-earned cash to. Mass transit indirectly subsidizes car use because it relieves pressure on arterials where transit stations are. When I do use transit, it's electric-powered and power generation comes from the nuke plants or from the PJM interconnection... mostly nat-gas based power. All local.

That's great. So explain why a private entity couldn't handle this instead of the government?
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#8
bac0nfat;100753 Wrote:
ArcticSplash;100746 Wrote:By me not driving, I'm giving you 9 feet of extra space on I-95 that I would otherwise be using. Because I don't drive hardly at all, I'm avoiding funding terrorist countries like Saudi Arabia which the rest of you freely give your hard-earned cash to. Mass transit indirectly subsidizes car use because it relieves pressure on arterials where transit stations are. When I do use transit, it's electric-powered and power generation comes from the nuke plants or from the PJM interconnection... mostly nat-gas based power. All local.

That's great. So explain why a private entity couldn't handle this instead of the government?

Privately-owned and self-funded wouldn't work because that's the model that existed before that collapsed because of the auto. You want to get from Media over to Bensalem. Are you going to use SEPTA? Of course not that's stupid. Mass transit can't compete with non-fixed destinations. This isn't New York where there's a transit station nearly every single place one would ever want to go ever, and cabs handle the bits that transit can't make up for.


So what you're suggesting is akin to the Charter School situation where we pay some government-selected private company who bids out, lobbies politicians/payola, etc. and basically none of the unpleasantness with administrating transit is actually removed but just hidden somewhere and the only thing riders actually get is a new name, new livery fittings and new color scheme? Meh.


They tried to privatize the transit system in London and the government gave up and took it back.

Emoticon;100752 Wrote:SEPTA is 100% the very definition of failure in mass transit. The only subsidizing going on is to their stupid piece of shit union that has the city by the balls and makes them fold to their every whim. Every time I took the bus in Philly I always found myself enraged by the experience. I used to particularly like waiting 40 minutes on the C bus at night in the rain on Broad and boarding the first one that pulled up way late, paranoid I wouldn't see another C bus for another hour. Then after getting off... I would always see 2 other C buses almost empty tailgating the first rather than being spaced out at regular intervals, this was a pretty much daily occurrence. Then the regional rail ain't exactly cheap either. Nearly every subway station was filthy and smelled like piss constantly and would turn into a waterfall / subterranean river system regularly during rainstorms. The city hall station has major structural problems if you know where to look. The booth staff is pretty much always worthless and nasty. The token machines rarely would accept US currency as payment and would create massive lines while SEPTA has been saying for a decade they they were going to convert to a card system like every other major metro...I can go on and on. I don't know where the fuck that subsidy money goes because it certainly doesn't go into providing service comparable to EVERY other major city in the US. I also love the strategy of going in strike in the middle of the night without warning and stranding anyone who didn't work the day shift, giving the big fuck-off to their ridership.

Fuck SEPTA and their union. Here's that subsidy money for you hard at work...

[Image: septapuzzle.jpg]

Local 234 is one of the shittiest unions in all of Pennsylvania but that's not the fault of the SEPTA board.

The last strike was because the board was putting to have employees start paying 1% of their healthcare premiums (SEPTA City Transit Divisions contribute nothing to premiums), and that's what caused the last strike to happen.


They always pick the coldest days of the year to strike, too. I've lived through three so far and all three sucked. Luckily there's 4 unions and the Railroad Division union hardly ever strikes, so when the shittier CTD workers go on strike it only affects buses and subways within Philly but the railroads are usually still up.
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#9
ArcticSplash;100755 Wrote:
bac0nfat;100753 Wrote:That's great. So explain why a private entity couldn't handle this instead of the government?

Privately-owned and self-funded wouldn't work because that's the model that existed before that collapsed because of the auto. You want to get from Media over to Bensalem. Are you going to use SEPTA? Of course not that's stupid. Mass transit can't compete with non-fixed destinations. This isn't New York where there's a transit station nearly every single place one would ever want to go ever, and cabs handle the bits that transit can't make up for.


So what you're suggesting is akin to the Charter School situation where we pay some government-selected private company who bids out, lobbies politicians/payola, etc. and basically none of the unpleasantness with administrating transit is actually removed but just hidden somewhere and the only thing riders actually get is a new name, new livery fittings and new color scheme? Meh.


They tried to privatize the transit system in London and the government gave up and took it back.


Local 234 is one of the shittiest unions in all of Pennsylvania but that's not the fault of the SEPTA board.

The last strike was because the board was putting to have employees start paying 1% of their healthcare premiums (SEPTA City Transit Divisions contribute nothing to premiums), and that's what caused the last strike to happen.


They always pick the coldest days of the year to strike, too. I've lived through three so far and all three sucked. Luckily there's 4 unions and the Railroad Division union hardly ever strikes, so when the shittier CTD workers go on strike it only affects buses and subways within Philly but the railroads are usually still up.
[/quote]



It effected Philly too...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Mot...conspiracy
The forum poster formerly known as Emoticon...
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#10
ArcticSplash;100755 Wrote:Privately-owned and self-funded wouldn't work because that's the model that existed before that collapsed because of the auto. You want to get from Media over to Bensalem. Are you going to use SEPTA? Of course not that's stupid. Mass transit can't compete with non-fixed destinations. This isn't New York where there's a transit station nearly every single place one would ever want to go ever, and cabs handle the bits that transit can't make up for.

They tried to privatize the transit system in London and the government gave up and took it back.

If it collapses because the demand isn't there, then should we even have it anyway?

And since when do we care what London does? Remember we're talking about the place that considered banning fire extinguishers.
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