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rumour: 5.45x39 7n6 steel core ATF ban according to james yeager
#1
i've disliked james yeager for quite a while. he's easy to hate.so when he started a run on 7.62x39 two weeks ago by posting a video, my blood boiled.

a couple of days ago, he posted a terse message on his facebook page claiming to have received a letter from the atf that 5.45 is now restricted. when pressed for a copy of the letter, he responded with "i don'ttake orders from you" and dropped the topic.

now tbs is running an article about it with supposed proof. what do you guys think?

http://www.thebangswitch.com/import-ban-on-7n6-5-45x39/

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Quote:What’s interesting is that the Form 6 hasn’t been rejected yet, which would be the normal procedure. It appears the ATF is simply sitting on Form 6′s for steel core 5.45×39 ammo for some reason. I suspect they’re waiting for a formal ruling to come down from the BATF overlords before the official denial letters are sent out.

So, has the ATF definitively shut off all steel core 7N6 5.45×39 imports? Not officially, but it looks as though there is something afoot, and that “something” doesn’t look pretty.

my first reaction was that james yeager was making a mint off of reselling his ammo stockpiles. now i'm not so sure.
Stirpot
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#2
Yeah, but aren't there AK pistols in 7.62? Wouldn't 7.62 be illegal for import since they are armor piercing too? This is just speculation by myself and no hard evidence.
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#3
Philadelphia Patriot;139266 Wrote:Yeah, but aren't there AK pistols in 7.62? Wouldn't 7.62 be illegal for import since they are armor piercing too? This is just speculation by myself and no hard evidence.

Shhhhhh, don't say that too loud!!!

For that matter there are .308 pistols and 5.56 pistols too so Shrug
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#4
How the hell can they ban all ammo because one gun happens to be a pistol? So AR pistols should be?

Oh, I forgot, it's the ATF... they don't care about logic, the Constitution, or liberty in general.
tolerance for failure meter... LOW
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#5
steel core 7.62x39 has been banned from import for a long time. iirc, there is a codified exemption in atf regulations/laws for .308 AP (black tip), 5.7x28, and 5.56mm.

Quote:On 2 February 1994, there was issued an ATF encyclical placing 35 importers of "7.62 X 39mm steel core ammunition" and all Federal Firearms Licensees on immediate notice that those rounds were now considered "armor piercing." Quoting ATF Director, John W. Magaw, as stating "…(t)hese bullets are designed, when used in handguns, to pose a life-threatening risk to all law enforcement officers," the notification stated:
Quote:Recent production of handguns that are designed to fire 7.62 X 39mm steel core ammunition has resulted in the reclassification of that ammunition as armor piercing (which) can only be sold to law enforcement or governmental agencies. Prior to introduction of these handguns in the marketplace, 7.62 X 39mm ammunition was not considered armor piercing, because it was only used in rifles -- primarily SKS/AK rifles.

http://www.thegunzone.com/762x39.html
Stirpot
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#6
Armor piercing is a joke anyway. FMJ of almost all rifle calibers can penetrate all level 3A armor that will commonly be found but even a 7.62x54R-AP will not penetrate AR500, so really, what's it matter?
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#7
Mr_Gixxer;139299 Wrote:Armor piercing is a joke anyway. FMJ of almost all rifle calibers can penetrate all level 3A armor that will commonly be found but even a 7.62x54R-AP will not penetrate AR500, so really, what's it matter?

I was just about to say the same thing too.
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#8
Philadelphia Patriot;139300 Wrote:
Mr_Gixxer;139299 Wrote:Armor piercing is a joke anyway. FMJ of almost all rifle calibers can penetrate all level 3A armor that will commonly be found but even a 7.62x54R-AP will not penetrate AR500, so really, what's it matter?

I was just about to say the same thing too.

I'd also add though that what should matter is that either it all should be legal or all common rifle calibers be illegal because they can penetrate normal body armor. Calling something armor piercing is the joke really without first defining the armor which isn't defined as far as I know.
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#9
Something to remember here... James Yeager is a complete douche. It amazes me how many people actually think he knows what he's talking about. He thinks he's God Almighty and how dare you ask him a question! That's his attitude. That's why for the longest time he would disable comments on his videos.
NRA (Life), GOA, FOAC (Life), NAGR, AMGOA

RocketFoot's Minion since 09-07-2012
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#10
bigdawgbeav;139302 Wrote:Something to remember here... James Yeager is a complete douche. It amazes me how many people actually think he knows what he's talking about. He thinks he's God Almighty and how dare you ask him a question! That's his attitude. That's why for the longest time he would disable comments on his videos.

I'm not familiar with Mr. Yeager. Irrespective of Mr. Yeager's popularity, the important point is the validity of the message. If someone has indeed made a handgun that fires 5.45x39, BATFE will have precedent to ban steel core (not just armor piercing) 5.45x39 from not just import, but also transfer. That means gun shops with 5.45 in stock won't be able to sell or transfer it.

The gunzone link describes the 7.62x39 episode, 5.45 could just as easily go down the same road.

I did a google for 5.45 pistols, I was able to find at least three:
http://www.akfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66399
http://www.akfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=97236
http://www.sksboards.com/smf/index.php?topic=36032.0

Based on the 1993 reasoning, I don't think the 5.45 pistols need to go into full production. Steel core 7.62x39 was banned when BATF got wind of six prototypes. However, the author (Dean Speir) cites the then-director's impulsive & ham-fisted nature as a major factor in that decision.

Upshot: 5.45x39 is long accepted here, it'll still be available, and even importable without a steel core. Unless relations with Russia really go down the toilet (along with Bulgaria & possibly Romania), 5.45 will still be importable as long as it's lead-core. And then there's domestic production.
Subject matter expert on questions no one's asking.
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