pa2a.org


Share Thread:  
The real problem with the US economy.
#1
Let me start by saying I'm not an expert in this field. However I have come to a sort of conclusion based on bits and pieces hears here and there. I'm also not very good at remembering numbers, so, don't ask me for any.

I've come to understand the problem in our economy as being caused by a major, negative culture shift within our professional world. Let me also add that I understand that despite what the mass media may imply the economy's struggles aren't because we're weaker than the rest of the world, we're not, but our economy is considered weak relative to itself in the past and what we know it could/should be.

Allow me to illustrate my understanding of the culture shift, which predates my birth. Henry Ford created a still to this day, strong and powerful business. Most of which is in manufacturing. Henry Ford's business philosophy was that if you paid your employees well enough to buy your product they would buy it, happily, which returns the money to the business and allows it to grow infinitely, which it has. Henry Ford opened his manufacturing plants paying the lowest waged employees $5 a day. Which was a lot of money at the time and more importantly it was enough to allow his employees to actually purchase Model-T vehicles. Which was a pretty big deal. Since the employees could afford to buy those products, they did buy those products and the business grew, hired more employees and grew, grew, grew. Always getting larger, better. This philosophy drove many companies through the 20's, 30's, 40's, 50's and that's what we consider our great boom.

Now a days companies, such as those in manufacturing, pay their employees as little as allowed by law or just enough to keep them working there. With hardly enough to buy all of the products they produce, especially not comfortably. How many of us, buy mostly what we have to buy and what we want once in a while? This is killing business. They're killing their own business. They're paying their employees to cover their 'needs' and therefor little, if anything, makes it back to the company in purchasing wants.

Our decades of plenty were created by businessmen who chose to pay their employees plenty. In those days the CEO of a company saw it has his job to take care of his employees, managers and share-holders. They were his customers. Today, the CEO looks after the share-holder's interests and to hell with anyone else. The end result, less for everyone.

It's also worth considering that the business owner of today pays himself 400x the wage of the lowest paid employee, whereas the business owner of Ford's day paid himself only 40x, which was still enough for him to be as rich as deserved. I'm not advocating wealth distribution. On the contrary. It's their companies and it's their money and it's their right to shoot themselves in the foot as often as they'd like. I'm just stating the facts as I see them.
"As I lay rubber down the street I pray for traction I can keep, but if I spin and begin to slide, please dear God, protect my sweet ride."
Reply
#2
I would say the biggest part of the problem is that we are no longer a manufacturing powerhouse. We're just an R&D center with a service economy.
Reply
#3
The Communists are in control, prosperity is not in the equation.....you and I under their thumbs, is. Making you dependent is the method.
"In 4 more OMao years you won't like how America looks....I guarantee it."
“When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty.” -- Thomas Jefferson
Reply
#4
Exactly, my explanation is to the cause of that fact. My previous post was aimed at explaining why it has become that way. The service economy is simply not productive. GDP grows when production grows. Service does not produce anything. You're absolutely right though.

(09-13-2012, 10:07 AM)Valorius Wrote: I would say the biggest part of the problem is that we are no longer a manufacturing powerhouse. We're just an R&D center with a service economy.


Yes. This rather simply explains the primary cause of loss of manufacturing and productive employment. Government regulation has strangled our manufacturing industry to death. Probably intentionally.

(09-13-2012, 10:21 AM)Pocketprotector Wrote: The Communists are in control, prosperity is not in the equation.....you and I under their thumbs, is. Making you dependent is the method.
"As I lay rubber down the street I pray for traction I can keep, but if I spin and begin to slide, please dear God, protect my sweet ride."
Reply
#5
Shit could be turned around if Americans could get jobs in factories producing something. Service jobs, retail jobs. America doesn't make goods for it's own consumption anymore. Like Byblos said, most People are only surviving these days.
Government gets what government wants, folks dependent on it. They keep doing the same things to fix the problem with the same result. Add in a little class warfare and promises of jobs in yet to be discovered/started industries.
Reply
#6
What the economy needs is JOBS, and lots of them. Employers aren't hiring because they can't afford to hire more employees.

In my opinion, the biggest thing that led to the downfall of our economy was the sub-prime mortgage crisis. Lots of people and corporations lost tons of money on mortgage securities that went bad. Everything snowballed from there. Also, the economy probably grew way too fast between the mid 80's and the start of the downfall. It was only a matter of time before the bubble popped.

It also doesn't help matters that the government relentlessly puts burdens on businesses. They are constantly increasing the cost to run a business by EPA regulations, HUGE taxes, fees, restrictions, etc. It discourages growth, and it discourages people from starting their own businesses. Without prosperous businesses, we don't have jobs, and without jobs, we don't have people spending money, and without people spending money, businesses don't prosper. It's a vicious circle and the government is making it worse by getting involved.
Reply
#7
So what you're saying is that the CNC Machinist making about $28,000(avg) a year while his supervisor is making $60,000(which really makes me not want to know what the even higher ups make, I'm guessing $85,000-90,000 for the pres) is what the downfall of this country is? Especially when the higher ups can't even tell you what CNC stands for? 

Cuz I couldn't agree more. I swear there used to be a time when you started on the bottom and worked your way up. Now its not what you know, its who you blow.
"What you're feeling now ain't the worst pain. The worst thing is not feeling the hurt anymore."
Reply
#8
(09-13-2012, 02:32 PM)spartakis252 Wrote: So what you're saying is that the CNC Machinist making about $28,000(avg) a year while his supervisor is making $60,000(which really makes me not want to know what the even higher ups make, I'm guessing $85,000-90,000 for the pres) is what the downfall of this country is? Especially when the higher ups can't even tell you what CNC stands for? 

Cuz I couldn't agree more. I swear there used to be a time when you started on the bottom and worked your way up. Now its not what you know, its who you blow.


CNC lathe machinist should move outta this area.  About 40-45k average in NJ.  $50k in NY. 

Hell back home I used to charge $90+/hr PC/tech services, now about $40.  Regional market pays what it can support.  Dont like the what the region pays?  Move to another region.


Answer to OP:
This is the REAL problem with the US economy:
[Image: AntiObamaUSA.png]
[Image: incubi+INK.jpg]. ABC,CBS,NBC,CNN no diff
Reply
#9
The circle of prosperity which I outlined earlier has been replaced by a circle of permanent stagnation. Perhaps I should have referred to my post as how things could, should, and used to be in better times and why things are suddenly so different. You're absolutely right.

(09-13-2012, 11:29 AM)bac0nfat Wrote: What the economy needs is JOBS, and lots of them. Employers aren't hiring because they can't afford to hire more employees.

In my opinion, the biggest thing that led to the downfall of our economy was the sub-prime mortgage crisis. Lots of people and corporations lost tons of money on mortgage securities that went bad. Everything snowballed from there. Also, the economy probably grew way too fast between the mid 80's and the start of the downfall. It was only a matter of time before the bubble popped.

It also doesn't help matters that the government relentlessly puts burdens on businesses. They are constantly increasing the cost to run a business by EPA regulations, HUGE taxes, fees, restrictions, etc. It discourages growth, and it discourages people from starting their own businesses. Without prosperous businesses, we don't have jobs, and without jobs, we don't have people spending money, and without people spending money, businesses don't prosper. It's a vicious circle and the government is making it worse by getting involved.
"As I lay rubber down the street I pray for traction I can keep, but if I spin and begin to slide, please dear God, protect my sweet ride."
Reply
#10
OP, I think you made some very good points. Unfortunately, I think we are now beyond the point where we can simply raise the income level for the average front-line employee.

I think there has been enough .gov interference that most businesses can't afford to increase the pay rate for the average employee.  While management can lower their income, there are so many employees compared to line workers that spreading the wealth around would not result in a significant raise for the line employee.  I know this isn't the case in all companies, but it is the case for a lot of them.

Honestly, I think the .gov needs to get out of businesses, revamp the current tax structure, and have a balanced budget (including paying down the national debt) for the economy to start to turn around.

I also think that the American public (and businesses) needs to stop paying for things on credit and only buy what they can afford.  I know, easier said than done, but I still think this is necessary.
Reply






Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Obummer a real lame duck now Xringshooter 1 488 11-05-2014, 06:59 PM
Last Post: Coops
  Here's What A Real Pres. Would Do. Good Read. das 4 913 05-30-2014, 01:13 PM
Last Post: ExcelToExcel
  NSA Spying Now Damaging American Tech Economy ArcticSplash 2 764 03-25-2014, 05:45 AM
Last Post: halftrack
  Math Problem: Rep. Jackson Lee claims Constitution is 400 years old das 17 1,752 03-18-2014, 05:15 AM
Last Post: das
  The Reverend Jesse Jackson finally Tweets his Real Intentions middlefinger 0 461 01-25-2014, 08:57 PM
Last Post: middlefinger



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)

Software by MyBB, © 2002-2015 MyBB Group.
Template by Modogodo Design.