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Update to the gay cake fiasco... Updated again 8/23
#1
Long story short, there has been an update to the gay cake fiasco, now the government tells you to an even higher degree who you can or can't serve in your own business. Take another chip out of our constitutional rights... I really hope sooner or later people start to figure out that anti-discrimination lawsuits do nothing but erode our freedoms and further the concept of protected classes. Personally, I think that their refusal to serve the couple was archaic and shooting themselves in the foot to say the least, but if they feel that by serving them they themselves would be placed in a situation whereby they needed to compromise their religious beliefs, then it was their right to refuse service to whomever they choose. It just goes to show that in our "progressive" society some people are quickly becoming more "equal" than others. They have really opened the Pandora's box here with this ruling.

On a side note if they want to go down this route I can think of a few more potential issues...

-What happens if a gun store owner refuses a sale to a person who they perceive as being mentally unstable, but that person tries to claim the proprietor denying the sale was discriminatory for some reason?

-What would happen if a bachelorette party came into a gay person's bakery establishment and wanted a lewd phallic cake or something of that nature that maybe the bakery wouldn't want their companies image associated with? I've already read about a number of gay bars catering to men primarily refusing to allow bachelorette parties because they are found to be too "disruptive" to the other patrons. Oh but, that's okay because they're not a protected class.

In my opinion regardless of where you stand on the homosexuality issue if you don't like the service provided to you by some business or are offended in some way by the way they operate, you are more than welcome to start your own competing business or service and serve whomever else you choose. There should be no such thing as gay rights, there should be human rights where all men are equal under the law and held to the same standard regardless of ethnicity or beliefs.

Here's the updated article:

http://www.10news.com/news/u-s-world/jud...s-12082013

Update 2: 6/3 There's another update to this story...

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2014/06/0...ing-after/

So there it is guys! State mandated slavery and forced state re-education. What a victory for civil rights guys! Woo! I wish more people were able to see this for what it is regardless of their stance on gay people, and just see that the gay community has just assisted this tyrannical government to get one step closer to the authoritarian state and that they have only been used as a means to an end.

Update 3: 8/23 Two more stories about the government abolishment of private property rights in the name of "civil rights". Goodbye American freedom!

http://www.timesunion.com/local/article/...689486.php

http://www.twincities.com/localnews/ci_2...ding-venue
The forum poster formerly known as Emoticon...
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#2
I read this the other day.

Having formerly owned this type of business, I want to say that wedding cakes are high visibility. You personally show up at the wedding to deliver. Also, depending on the photographer and level of publicity as well as your cake skill level, your name can be associated with that wedding far and wide. I had one of my own cakes that actually did not turn out well (although the bride loved it, there were some things that went wrong as the particular icing was a tricky meringue type) and the cake ended up in a magazine (to my horror) because the wedding itself was featured.

I say all that to say, a talented baker will have his name publicized. If a baker does not want to do certain themes or certain events (ie gay weddings) then he should not be forced to do so.

This is not the same as serving a gay person a chicken sandwich. Every cake you do has the opportunity to have your name associated with that event. A baker should be allowed to choose his associations.
Error 396: Signature cannot be found.
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#3
What bothers me the most about these cases is that it creates a situation whereby what is and is not discriminatory is entirely subjective. As a result the creation of double standards are effectively built into the concept, because some people are more popular and easier to "morally" defend in court than others. I'm interested too how campaign contributions can be considered free speech, but one's right to refuse service is not. Then again judges have to run for political office too so they might be inclined to see things in their favor just a bit...
The forum poster formerly known as Emoticon...
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#4
Thks is 100% bullshit. Thks is an absolute First Amendment violation, and this judge needs to be given the boot. The government can not force a private business to provide services to anyone.

What if this was a Muslim restaurant and someone came in demanding a ham sandwich? What's next? How about a gay couple who want kids point out a woman on the street and gets a judge to say she must become a surrogate mother for them... and never mind that she is already married with her own kids... I mean, she already makes babies, so what's the big deal?
tolerance for failure meter... LOW
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#5
Ten*K;127904 Wrote:Thks is 100% bullshit. Thks is an absolute First Amendment violation, and this judge needs to be given the boot. The government can not force a private business to provide services to anyone.

What if this was a Muslim restaurant and someone came in demanding a ham sandwich? What's next? How about a gay couple who want kids point out a woman on the street and gets a judge to say she must become a surrogate mother for them... and never mind that she is already married with her own kids... I mean, she already makes babies, so what's the big deal?

C'mon man, at least use better metaphors........

one is talking about an item not on the menu, and the other is just out there but.......

If the Muslim restaraunt refused to serve a "White Infidel" that would be more similar

"Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are ruined." -Patrick Henry
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#6
Ten*K;127904 Wrote:The government can not force a private business to provide services to anyone.

Yeah, they gots lots of nerve!

[Image: logo12070811591266977365.png]

[Image: whites-only.png]

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Dave, proudly annoying members of pa2a.org since Sep 2012.
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#7
Ohfergawdssake.

He's not a minister. He's a baker.

He does a job, and offers those services to the public.

He's not "ministering to" them; he's baking a cake.

Other than that, it's the customer who decides what kind of cake, with what icing, and with what written on it--- not the workman.

Great, he has pride in his work, and maybe somehow conflates it with being part of launching the happy couple to an eternity of joyful union, children, etc. Maybe he even prays over the dough.

That's his concern.

What is the state's business is that like people of color, of a given religion, etc., people with a given sexual orientation are protected against discrimination in that particular state.

If he were Catholic, should he be checking into whether one half of the couple might be previously married and divorced without a Church-granted anullment?

The state didn't stick its nose into the baker's business until he stuck his nose into the couple's.
gascolator, proud to be a member of pa2a.org since Nov 2012.
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#8
Dave;127917 Wrote:
Ten*K;127904 Wrote:The government can not force a private business to provide services to anyone.

Yeah, they gots lots of nerve!

[Image: logo12070811591266977365.png]

[Image: whites-only.png]

That about sums it up.

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A gun rack in a pick-up is not for holding guns. Its a place for women to hold on to. Smile
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#9
MrPeanut;127933 Wrote:[Image: no.jpg]

My black chihuahua is pissed!!Big Grin
NRA Life Member, NRA Certified Instructor:  HFS, Pistol, Rifle, PPIH,PPOH
Suarez Combat Arms Instructor School
Admit nothing.  Deny everything. Demand proof.
If we lie to the government, it's a crime. If the government lies to the people, it's called politics.
Paying for welfare is slavery.
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#10
Markheck1;127916 Wrote:
Ten*K;127904 Wrote:Thks is 100% bullshit. Thks is an absolute First Amendment violation, and this judge needs to be given the boot. The government can not force a private business to provide services to anyone.

What if this was a Muslim restaurant and someone came in demanding a ham sandwich? What's next? How about a gay couple who want kids point out a woman on the street and gets a judge to say she must become a surrogate mother for them... and never mind that she is already married with her own kids... I mean, she already makes babies, so what's the big deal?

C'mon man, at least use better metaphors........

one is talking about an item not on the menu, and the other is just out there but.......

If the Muslim restaraunt refused to serve a "White Infidel" that would be more similar

The metaphors aren't the point, it's the fact that the judge is violating the fundamental rule private property rights. If this judge doesn't believe in private property, then it's a short putt to the dissolution of habeas corpus from there.

Your rights no longer extend to even yourself, if the state deems another's rights supersede your own. This judge is forcing a private individual running a private business into an unwanted private transaction.

In capitalism, in a free market, you are able to deny service to anyone. They, in turn, are not forced to purchase your products or services.

If someone is vehemently against firearms and has a no firearms policy in their place of businesses, I don't have the right to bring my firearm into those premises. If I went to court to FORCE my custom on that business, despite the fact that there were plenty of other similar businesses in town, people would call me an asshole.

And Dave, this has nothing to do with discrimination. It is about the personal liberty and freedom of the individual, especially on their own property. This judge is installing a water hose and a slide on the "slippery slope", and judical activism is bullshit.
tolerance for failure meter... LOW
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